MENOMORPHOSIS
A podcast for busy midlifers ready to reclaim their energy, joy, and purpose.
Are you, like me, riding the rollercoaster of midlife and menopause, and eager to get back to living your best life? Are you tired of low energy, a short temper and endless self doubt?
Well, It’s time to stress less and shine more. It’s time ditch the worry, reclaim your mojo and unleash your inner brilliance.
It's never too late to transform, and you’re certainly not too old. And in my opinion, midlife and menopause provide the perfect opportunity to do just that.
Join me each week for uplifting stories and expert insights on how to feel as good as you can and create a joyful, purpose-driven life you truly love.
So when you’re ready, Let the beautiful menomorphosis begin!
MENOMORPHOSIS
#113: Skin, Hair & Hormones with GP & Menopause Specialist Dr Mandy Leonhardt
In this episode, I 'm joined by the brilliant Dr. Mandy Leonhardt - GP, menopause specialist, and author of What Every Woman Needs to Know About Her Skin and Hair. We explore how hormonal changes during perimenopause and menopause affect skin and and hair health and discuss practical ways to navigate these shifts.
Dr. Mandy explains how changes in hormone levels during perimenopause and menopause can lead to skin dryness, wrinkles, hair thinning, and even adult acne. She also shares actionable tips on caring for your skin and hair during this life stage.
We dive into the effects of lifestyle choices like sun exposure and smoking on skin health, practical skincare routines for different ages and skin types, and the truth about collagen supplements.
Plus, we cover essential hair care practices and why early intervention is key for managing hair thinning during menopause.
If you're curious about protecting your skin and maintaining healthy hair this episode is for you! It's jam packed with expert advice and loads of actionable tips.
You’ll Learn:
😃 How hormonal changes during perimenopause and menopause affect skin elasticity, moisture, and hair growth
😃 The potential positive side effects of HRT for skin and hair health
😃 Why sun protection is crucial and whether it impacts vitamin D production
😃 Practical skincare routines for different skin types and stages of life
😃 The truth behind the effectiveness of collagen supplements
😃 Expert hair care advice, including managing hair thinning during menopause
To buy Dr Mandy's book click here
To find out more about Dr Mandy: https://hormoneequilibrium.co.uk/about/
https://www.instagram.com/hormoneequilibrium/
To find out more about my membership The Inner Space go to: https://www.pollywarren.com/theinnerspace
Email me at: info@pollywarren.com
https://www.pollywarren.com/
https://www.instagram.com/pollywarrencoaching/
Are you, like me, riding the roller coaster of midlife and menopause and eager to get back to living your best life? Are you tired of low energy, a short temper and endless self-doubt? Well, it's time to stress less and shine more. It's time to ditch the worry, reclaim your mojo and unleash your inner brilliance. It's never too late to transform, and you're certainly not too old and, in my opinion, midlife and menopause provide the perfect opportunity to do just that. Join me each week for inspiring stories and expert insights on topics covering all things midlife, menopause and personal development. So when you're ready, let the beautiful menomorphosis begin. Hello, and welcome back to Menomorphosis. I hope you're doing really well. I hope you've had a great week.
Polly:I must admit I am loving the lighter days, the lighter mornings. Down here in Brighton, we've just been having the most incredible low tides in the mornings and the evenings, and they seem to be coinciding with sunrise and sunset. So I've been loving that. I love a sunrise or sunset. They just, they just really remind you of how, how insignificant we are in the grand scheme of things and that, whatever happens, you get the opportunity to have a new start every single day. So, yes, get outside, enjoy this beautiful weather we're having here in the UK, if you're in the UK.
Polly:Okay, on to this week's episode, which is an interview with Dr Mandy Leonhard Mandy has written a fantastic book called what Every Woman Needs to Know About Her Skin and Hair, and it's about how the hormones on your inside affect you on the outside. Honestly, this book has been so fascinating to read. I have learned so much, and we dive into it today. In this episode we talk about all things skin aginging, skin collagen, skincare routines. We talk about hair, hair thinning, how best to look after your hair. It honestly is jam-packed. Dr Mandy is a GP. She also holds a certificate in menopause care from the British Menopause Society and she's also a certified gynecological endocrinology practitioner. I'm sure you're going to get a lot out of this episode. So, without further ado, please welcome the brilliant Dr Mandy Leonhart. Thank you so much, dr Mandy, for joining me here today on Menomorphosis. Welcome to the show oh, hello Polly, nice to meet you.
Polly:Yes, you too, and I'm very excited to dive in to topics of skin hair if we've got time, maybe nails as well, because I've just been, as I was saying, been reading your book what every woman needs to know about her skin and hair, which I've really enjoyed. And I've just been, as I was saying, been reading your book what Every Woman Needs to Know About Her Skin and Hair, which I've really enjoyed, and I've kind of been. I probably have read most of it now, but it's a book you can actually just pick up, have a flip through, find a section you're interested in read it.
Dr Mandy:It was meant to be a book that women can read and dip in and out of. It's probably not something you you might want to take it to the beach, but it's more of a. You know you can use it as a reference as you experience symptoms. What inspired?
Polly:you to write this book.
Dr Mandy:I am a GP and a menopause specialist and I see women with mental cycle related problems and I see women in the paramenopause and postmenopause and I help them through that journey. And a lot of the questions I get is when they point to their hair or their face and they point out an area of concern. For example, they get spots around their chin or more hair growth on the chin and they ask me is this hormonal? Is this just? Is it going to go away? Or my hair is thinning, is it going to progress? Is it going to carry on? Will is it going to carry on? Will I lose my hair? And previously, um, I gave them a vague answer and I thought, oh, I need to look this up a bit more in detail and I need to offer a more, a more comprehensive solution to you know more of an answer than than just oh, well, yes, it could be hormonal. Um, and also in a previous book I've written, called the complete, with with my friend Dr Hannah Short, who's been on this?
Polly:he's been on this podcast. Who I interviewed on this podcast a while ago?
Dr Mandy:yes, so we wrote um the book, the complete guide to pui and menopause, and we have a head to toe section and in the head to toe section I did the skin and hair um chapter, or the section for that, and I really did a deep dive into how our hormones, or if they're no longer there or if you've got pu or early menopause, how that can affect your appearance and not just your well-being but also your, your hair, your skin aging, your elasticity, and what can you do about it.
Dr Mandy:You know, bearing in mind that not every woman can take hrt, um, um or you know, going through cancer treatment and so on.
Dr Mandy:So and I found it hugely interesting and I went down some rabbit holes where I looked at different hormones and how they affect our appearance, and then I stumbled across these new concepts of brain-skin connection but also gut-skin connections, and these are relatively new concepts, and I realised that our endocrine system is hugely complicated and the skin is a is a part of our endocrine system, is actually an endocrine gland in its own right, and that our skin can make pretty much all hormones that we make in the large glands, like adrenal glands or thyroid glands, or in our ovaries. That the skin is. The skin is able, able to do that, and it doesn't just respond to the brain, it responds to the gut, it also responds to external stresses and environmental factors. So it's hugely complicated, and so, to answer the question, when I get asked, is this hormonal? Then it is not always a straightforward answer. But, yes, our hormones play a huge role in our skin and hair health.
Polly:Yeah, everything is so connected to each other, isn't it? I'd love to start really by thinking about our skin, because I think the questions a lot of my listeners will have would be about skin and about ageing and how our impact the, the speed of which we age, because I know that post-menopause, those five years after menopause, the acceleration of aging is quite fast and I think that can that can really concern quite a lot of women. So I wonder, mandy, whether you might just talk to that a bit about how perimenopause, menopause, how that really affects our skin our skin provides a barrier to the outside.
Dr Mandy:It keeps our organs in and keeps the environment out, and it's a it's meant it has a really important barrier function. It's meant to keep most things out. That's why skincare companies struggle with effective treatments, because most things that um are meant to be not going through the skin and are meant to kept out, be kept out and and when it comes to healthy skin, we all want um elastic skin, moist skin, well moisturized skin, resilient skin that is blemish-free and that withstands certain challenges in the environment, but also when we don't feel well, when we don't sleep well, and so on, and our best. So we have our best collagen level. So it's probably around age 25, around that time, and that's usually when we're healthy and we have a menstrual cycle and that is hopefully very regular and predictable. And then we have the perimenopause, which starts at the age of the late 30s, but also early 40s. Most women they may or may not have physical symptoms, they may not notice, but some women will may already feel really dreadful. So what happens is the collagen from our mid-20s starts to decline at a slow rate. So collagen is the main uh building block, the main protein in within our skin. It's made in fibroblasts, which are uh cells in our dermis, so the skin layers are like a sandwich. So you've got um, you've got the outer layer and then the dermis, which is the squishy layer, with all that where all the magic happens, and the weather where the fibroblasts sit and they make collagen and collagen, but they also make elastin. So you have both structural supporting proteins that keep everything in shape, but you also have elastin, which is really important for the skin's ability to bounce back, and both of these are really not made at a great deal anymore beyond beyond puberty. So what we've got, then, is really what we have to maintain for life.
Dr Mandy:We know that estrogen is a really important molecule to stimulate collagen production, and we see a huge increase during puberty, when girls start having their menstrual cycle and they start to produce estrogen, they start to have their period. That's when collagen production really increases and that also solidifies and consolidates our bone health, because bones are nothing else other than collagen, just compacted, very tightly packed collagen fibers. So that's why, during perimenopause, when we see eastern fluctuating quite like crazily, and then it starts to decline and menopause is our last period, and then the post-menopausal years are defined by lower and very low levels of estrogen and in the first five years after we have no longer have estrogen at substantial quantities, we lose about a third of our overall collagen. So that means that we notice, uh, wrinkles appearing. The elasticity in the skin goes and the dynamic wrinkles are no longer dynamic, they're now static. So it means that we can visually see wrinkles not just when we move our face but also when we, when we're resting our face. So these are the two types. So wrinkles are one concern, but the other problem is skin dryness. So estrogen is a hormone that very much is involved in in increasing moisture levels in in the skin. It increases hyaluronic acid. It has many functions to to um, to keep retain water within the skin.
Dr Mandy:One of the downsides might be pregnancy, for example. So some women have great skin during pregnancy, but we also have more volume overall and we get water retention. So you know, you can have puffy skin because you have a lot, you carry a lot of heat during pregnancy, for example. But menopause it's the opposite. A lot of women will probably have find that their skin becomes much drier, it can become itchy. There's a menopause specific symptom called formication, not fornication, which is something else formication, which is, yes, skin um, it's called a skin crawling sensation, which is really debilitating. It's very unpleasant it made. It does not come along with a rash, it's not visible, but it's just a sensation within the skin. We can't explain why it happens, but it is typically a sensation within the skin. We can't explain why it happens, but it is typically associated.
Dr Mandy:One of the things that's associated with this is menopause and possibly lack of estrogen. So estrogen is very, very important. Testosterone is another hormone that is very important. That does decline much slower and, as we see an imbalance between the two hormones, the testosterone is still quite stable, whereas estrogen has dropped. We can see in some women, particularly in the paramenopause, where they get adult acne so they had acne as a teenager and now thatestrogen fluctuates and the testosterone still remains stable, they will see a change in their oil production and, in particular, androgenic areas like the lower neck and the chin. They'll see increased hair growth and more spots in that area, or they can also see a rosacea flaring up which is inflammatory.
Dr Mandy:Yeah, so overall and throughout the female life cycle, our changing hormones can definitely have a massive impact on our skin and hair health and I think the most dramatic time for women is possibly pregnancy and post-pregnancy, particularly for hair, but also perimenopause, which can bring on things like acne on the chin and hair thinning, and postmenopausal, where you have predominantly symptoms like very dry skin, itchy skin, hair thinning, loss of elasticity, loss of collagen, wrinkles coming more pronounced. So these are the problem and we all know that from our vaginal era. We all go on about how important it is to look after vaginal area, where skin dryness and vaginal we used to call it vaginal atrophy, we now call it genitourinary syndrome, syndrome of the menopause, where we know the benefits of estrogen are very, very clear. And you know, the same that happens to our vulva happens really in the rest of our body as well. Um, so that's why we know oestrogen has a huge impact on skin barrier function and wound healing as well. Yes, I mean no it's good.
Polly:Yeah, there's a lot isn't there, and the impact is huge. So the question is what can we do to really support ourselves to have healthy skin, to have healthy hair for as long as possible during this time? Maybe we could start by talking about HRT, because I think that's the first thing on my mind, which is like gosh, if you take a, if you are someone who does take HRT during perimenopause, has that been proven to help, uh, prevent such rapid aging of the skin? Has it helped? Is it, has it been proven to help with hair loss, for example?
Dr Mandy:yeah. So that's a really good question and I really looked into that. So, um, in the perimenopause a lot of women think that that it's it's a luck, so that the estrogen immediately drops, or that the problem is the lack of estrogen. But in the early paramenopause it's actually the fluctuating levels of estrogen. So while you're still having periods, estrogen, you still make estrogen. Any woman who has periods, who is paramenopause and hasn't stopped her periods naturally if she has periods, hasn't stopped her periods naturally she. And if she has periods, she makes estrogen.
Dr Mandy:Sometimes periods can become extremely heavy and often in this phase where women have very heavy periods that are very close together, giving the HRT or extra estrogen can backfire and in my own practice I tend to be very careful in that phase to give women more estrogen. Often what they need is actually progesterone or they need menstrual cycle control. And in that phase where women have very heavy periods, hair thinning is usually due to low iron levels, so they lose a lot of blood, they lose iron, they're also very stressed, they may not sleep and a lot of this has an impact on the hair. So in that particular phase I would very much look at at thyroid function function, which can also mess with your menstrual cycle. I would look at are you losing a lot of blood? Are you flooding? You might need to take an iron level to have your iron levels checked. Um, and I would also.
Dr Mandy:I would not necessarily think that this woman will benefit from hrt there. There's certainly no data, no evidence that that's the case. And when it comes to HRT in the post-menopausal years, we have some studies that looked at whether HRT slows down skin aging, and there is. There is probably an argument for the benefits of HRT, but there might be a window of opportunity during which you ought to have started HRT to see the benefits, similar to cardiovascular benefits. So we do not recommend HRT for the prevention of cardiovascular disease, but we do know that if you started within the first five years after your last period, you may see some benefits for heart health because, as I said before, estrogen benefits elasticity, skin elasticity and collagen, and our blood vessels also contain or are made up of collagen and we keep them nice and elastic. We have potential benefits for cardiovascular disease prevention, but we don't use it for that purpose, and I think the same applies to HRT and skin. So if you start HRT in your late 50s, when you've already been postmenopausal for 10 years, you might still get benefits for menopausal symptoms. So if you keep on having night sweats and hot flushes, that might still benefit you and you can certainly go on HRT.
Dr Mandy:But I wouldn't put your hopes up for great major benefits of turning back the clock with regards to wrinkles and hair thinning. We have virtually very few, none or only very limited data when it comes to hair growth, but there are some studies that looked at topical application of estrogen solutions on the scalp which have shown benefits for hair growth. We do have some data on skin thickness and there are a bit conflicting messages here. Some studies have shown huge benefits for not huge, but have shown some benefits for skin thickness and maintaining skin thickness in women who are on HRT. Other studies have shown no benefits, but in my view, from all that I've read, hrt is likely more beneficial than not. So taking HRT will likely have benefits for skin and hair, provided that you started before.
Dr Mandy:You have been too long without estrogen. So that's why maybe in the late paramenopause, when your periods start to skip and become, the time between periods become longer and longer, or you're in your first few years after your last period and you have menopausal symptoms, then you might find that actually, after you start HRT, your skin becomes more resilient, your itching disappears, your skin becomes more moist again, your hair grows faster. We do know that estrogen maintains hair growth phases. So as we get older, let's say, in a 20-year-old, her hair will grow for around seven years, if she's lucky. So she will grow really long hair and it will stay in that growing phase for much longer, whereas as we get older, that growing phase will be shorter and shorter. So you will struggle as an 80-year-old woman to grow hair to the same length as a girl who is 20, because the hair will fall out after three to four years or even less than that. So we know that estrogen keeps hair in the growing phase. Estrogen keeps hair in the growing phase.
Dr Mandy:Estrogen also um provides. Um is helpful for the follicle a hair follicle to make her thicker. It brings blood supply to the, to the scalp. So there are many, many benefits of that.
Dr Mandy:But what I need to emphasize is that hrt is not meant or licensed to be used as an anti-aging product for hair, skin and nail, even though we can potentially see the benefits, and they're they're very clear. But we shouldn't be giving this to women for that purpose. You ought to have other menopause related symptoms to justify going on HRT, because it can come with side effects and risks and it it is certainly not to say that if you don't go on hrt that you can't still use other treatments for your hair growth or your skin and there's no point taking hrt thinking you're doing something really great for your skin and hair when you then don't use sunscreen and you smoke and you drink lots of alcohol. Right, it is not the panacea for for eternal youth. I just want to emphasize that. But hormones individually absolutely have been shown to have benefits for hair growth, moisture levels in the skin, um, skin maintaining, skin thickness, skin thickness. So that's all good and it might be a nice little add-on benefit for you if you do start it at the right time.
Polly:But the thing is we we can't give it to women specifically for that yeah, I understand, yeah, that all makes absolute, total sense and I think that you're very right to just emphasize that it's not the thing to go and rush out and ask your doctor for if, uh, it just to for better skin and hair. So, what you mentioned then about the smoking, the sun, the alcohol, is probably where everyone should really focus their attention on most. I mean what, what I read in your book about alcohol? Because smoking, I think we all can agree. We all know that that is really detrimental. Yes, yes, which I think a lot of young people don't put in the same camp as smoking, which is worrying. Uh, it's one of my biggest regrets as a young person.
Polly:Smoking I you know it really is, because I can tell on my skin now that the effects of it if you, you smoked at some point in your life so I did in my teenager to early 20s and then stopped is that damage permanent? If the skin cells are renewing every, is it six up to every six weeks, six to eight weeks? Yeah, yeah, then do those cells get renewed, even if you have damaged them during whilst you've been smoking? Or, and I suppose, sun I mean we all know that sun damage doesn't go away. So, yeah, that was really what I was quite curious to find out a little bit more about, and we all know that sun damage doesn't go away.
Dr Mandy:So, yeah, that was really what I was quite curious to find out a little bit more about. Yes, so there is. With sunlight, we know there is accumulative sun damage. So we do know that the more sunburns, the more sun exposure you had, even as a teenager or as a young woman in your 20s or 30s, you will likely have more sun damage in your 50s, even if you never go into the sun. And again, that is accumulating, accumulates this, this kind of skin damage over time, because uv light really damages fibroblasts, the cells that I mentioned earlier, that that make and produce all that collagen and elastin fibers, and they get damaged through uv light.
Dr Mandy:We can't make new fibroblasts, it's what we've got, and if the fibroblasts are gone or damaged or no longer functional, you can't bring them back easily. You know we, we can try with with, you know radiofrequency and um. You know all these electro stimulating products that that inflict basically wounds, um or damage to fibroblasts, and only fibroblasts only do something or rejuvenate when they have been damaged. So after they've been injured, so when we have a wound, fibroblasts start to come back to life, as it were. But that's why these, these treatments often require a lot of downtime, because you have to damage the dermis to create a response to the, the inflicted wound, and then you see wound healing with um and and, as a side effect, you see an increase in collagen production again. Otherwise, fibroblasts will keep making collagen over time, but the rate at which they make it goes down every year and it's it's really hard and they do not. They haven't got a great turnover. I think the turnover of fibroblasts is sort of 13 years, so you can't make new fibroblasts. It's what you've got at the time you finished your teenage years.
Dr Mandy:And with regard to smoking, there's always a benefit any time when you stop smoking. So of course, again, there is, I think, an accumulative damage to both your lungs but also your skin, but it's always beneficial. And yes, you're right, when you stop smoking it will take a little bit of time, but your skin will turn over and renew itself and um, but the longer you smoked, the. If you have got wrinkles as a result of smoking, it is really difficult. They will not go back, they will not disappear. If they are actually wrinkles that are not dynamic lines. So you know these smoker lines around the mouth. They're very typical. So you cannot just to stop smoking will not get rid of those once they're not no longer dynamic.
Dr Mandy:But I think if you were very young and you stopped at a certain time, absolutely, the body is a very, very resilient organ. Our whole the skin is a very resilient organ and, yes, it's never too late to stop and there are things you can do and you. It is never too late to start sunscreen. It's never too late to minimize alcohol. Alcohol really breaks down collagen yeah, I mean that was.
Polly:That was shocking when I read about the alcohol how, how damaging that is, particularly to collagen and you have to.
Dr Mandy:I always envisage the worst case scenario is something that we associate with something lovely. So you sit somewhere in spain on a lovely terrace in a restaurant in the sun while drinking a glass of wine and smoking a cigarette, and that image of sun exposure, glass of wine, cigarette and no sunscreen is basically this image that I have in my head of, in the worst case scenario how you damage your skin and, yes, it feels good at the time, but you pay for it later.
Polly:And that is something I am going to drill down even more into my children about the skin damage, because if you've only got a certain amount of collagen in your skin, and that is at its peak at 25, then you've got to look after it so much in those years for your later life there's a difference between if you're just concerned about your face and your cleavage and your neck area, you know, of course you don't need to overthink every time you you wear shorts and you go out without sunscreen, and as long as you don't burn or go out in the midday sun, you know.
Dr Mandy:But but, yes, sunscreen every day if you go out. Um, ideally, factor 50 get used to just do this. You know, yeah, of course I do not wear sunscreen on my body in the winter. Um, if I'm fully clothed, of course not. Clothing is much better sun protector than sunscreen. We are notoriously bad at applying sunscreen and this is just, it's not foolproof. No sunscreen will will stop all skin damage. This is just a little um safety net. It's not a little, but it's very important safety net. But don't forget to wear a hat, stay in the shade and don't. You don't need to deliberately expose yourself to sunlight to make vitamin d, but equally, you do not need to avoid going outside either. Have fun. The sun is super important. It produces endorphins. It actually suppresses hunger in women and it increases hunger in men but suppresses hunger in women, so they eat more. You know, they have a more healthier relationship with food when they're, when we're out in the sun, endorphins, mood. It's so many benefits, is it?
Polly:a myth, then, that you can't get the vitamin d through your skin when you've got high factor sun cream on the evidence we have is up to that is up to factor 15.
Dr Mandy:So they have research, have taken a number of people. They put sunscreen on them and another group did not put sunscreen on them measured their vitamin D before and after sun exposure and they found that up to factor 15, that's what they used did not impair vitamin D production in their skin. So we have to also remember we are usually so. We do not usually apply sunscreen correctly and reapply it correctly, so we are usually worse in applying it and protecting ourselves. So I wouldn't overthink the idea that you can't make vitamin D. We certainly know factor 15 does not impair it and you do not need your entire body um soaked in sunlight. You, you need um your arms and legs for 10 minutes exposed to mid-morning or mid-afternoon light. It doesn't require a lot of sun uh exposure and absolutely put your your sunscreen on and go out, do your sport, have fun and you know. But sweat um exercise and you know, and water makes sunscreen quite quickly and active anyway. So you have to, in theory, apply it.
Dr Mandy:And who does that? You know I'm as bad as anyone else. I apply it in the morning and then probably never again in the day, even though we should. So don't overthink the sunscreen. We are notoriously bad with applying sunscreen, so don't you worry, you can easily make a sufficient vitamin d in the summer month. I do get it, though, because in the winter in the uk we do not get natural sunlight and as we get older, our skin's ability to produce vitamin d declines a lot. You know so if you're, by the time you're 80, you will, even though you stay in the same the same time in the sun. As a younger person, you'll not be able to make the same amount of vitamin D. So there is something to be said for supplementing with vitamin D, and in terms of sunscreen.
Polly:Again, another argument I hear is are the chemicals in the sunscreen itself. So it's kind of that. You know, do we put those chemicals on our skin versus the protection from the sun? What do you think about that? Do we put those chemicals on our skin?
Dr Mandy:versus the protection from the sun. What's what do you think about that? Yeah, so they have. They are extremely well researched and very safe.
Dr Mandy:There are some sunscreens that are have been shown not be to be great for the environment um, when we particularly when we go into natural waters, and we can avoid them. I've got a whole list of them in my book. So sunscreens do not really penetrate the skin into the bloodstream and if they do, then it's a tiny, tiny amount that will go into the bloodstream. And those that are available, at least in Europe or Australia, are perfectly safe to be used on our skin and they do not poison us. They are perfectly safe. There are some people who get sunscreen allergies, so they are sensitive to certain chemicals and they break out in a rash. Um, they're perfectly safe. We do.
Dr Mandy:There are some people who get a sun, sun screen allergy, so they are sensitive to certain chemicals and they break out in a rush when they apply certain chemical filters, and that's more common with chemical filters, and I get that. You know, if you are prone to sunscreen, um allergies, then I would opt for a mineral filter. So we've got chemical filters, which are those that protect the skin from the inside, and then we have mineral filters that they both work in similar ways. They both absorb heat and UV light. The mineral filters will also, if they're nano-based, penetrate a little bit into the skin.
Dr Mandy:By the way, mineral filters do not just work by reflecting the light, they actually absorb UV light. That's how they work, and they are much more cosmetically pleasing. So they're usually now based on zinc oxide or titanium dioxide, and in the past it used to be like pseudocreme, like a white paste, and they were not cosmetically pleasing. You looked like a ghost. Now we have much more elegant sunscreens and I particularly like the tinted sunscreens the mineral-based tinted sunscreens because they have iron oxides, and iron oxides also prevent damage from blue light and visible light as well, and they can double up as like a foundation or the.
Dr Mandy:yes, I like them, particularly for the face. But you know what? Don't overthink it. The sunscreens sold here in the UK and the European Union and Australia are highly regulated. They're tested, they are safe for humans and I would not overthink it at all. The downside of not applying a sunscreen is worse than using a chemical sunscreen is worse than using a chemical sunscreen. And if you have very oily skin and you can't use a mineral sunscreen because they make you break out, use a chemical filter. There's some really excellent, very safe chemical filters out there that are in a gel form. They're much, much more elegant to use in a, let's say, teenager with acne, you know, and who can't use an occlusive, mineral-based sunscreen. Um, you may have to shop around a little bit. Look at what suits you and if you found a good sunscreen, don't worry about the fact whether they're chemical or mineral based okay, great, thank you.
Polly:That really, that really really helps. So, moving on to that, you said that the sunscreen market is very regulated. Moving on to something which isn't so regulated, let's talk about collagen. So collagen is something which I mean you just have to spend one minute on well, I do on Instagram, and there's just so many people talking about different collagen powders, different collagen supplements. You can spend a fortune on collagen these days. Do they work, mandy? Is it worth people spending their money on collagen?
Dr Mandy:So I'm watching this space. I'm very open minded and I am absolutely open to any company who shows me really good evidence or shows me good long term data and so on. But so far I would say it is probably poor value for money. If you have a limited budget, I would rather you spend it on a good sunscreen and on good protective clothing you know Rush West and so on than on collagen supplement. If you're already taking collagen and you think you can afford it and you think it works for you, you know, carry on. You know if that's what you want to do. But I think overall I used to buy it. I stopped taking it. I saw no difference. Maybe I was too young at the time.
Dr Mandy:But the research that there was a meta-analysis that looked at all the research done and, yes, they found that collagen can potentially increase moisture levels in the skin and help with fine lines and wrinkles. But the problem we have is so these benefits are very, very small, very minor benefits. Right, these benefits are very, very small, very minor benefits, right. And some one argue could this not also be due to the fact that someone had a, a pint of liquid that they were drinking extra in the day. And collagen increases osmolality in the blood so it does carry it's it's it's water binding, so it does carry moisture to the skin with the water you drink. So it makes someone drink more fluid for a start, which can potentially, with a collagen, have a temporary effect. How much benefit that has in the long term we don't know yet. We haven't really had the long-term studies over years. And the other thing that we aren't sure about it what type of collagen exactly is beneficial? Is the the marine type one is a type one and three both? And at what quantities is it? Um, how much is a two milligram or 10 milligram? How much do we need to take, for how long to see which results?
Dr Mandy:There are lots and lots of unknowns and also the fact that a lot of, as you said quite rightly, collagen is made from waste byproducts from the animal industry. So it depends on where the company gets the raw material from. If they cut corners, it could potentially be quite harmful because there could be heavy metals like arsenic, mercury and lead, because that's where the animal stores these minerals in its lifetime. And if you take those cutoffs from cow hides and chicken skin and cartilage from animals as a byproduct. If they haven't been handled in hygienic environments, it could be contaminated with bacteria that could make you ill. So it's a very unregulated area and I personally think, even if you buy it from a very expensive supplier who has a very good track record and can show where it comes from and it's organic or whatnot, I think if the first baseline you have to get right is your food, your diet, and if you have a poor diet then yes, maybe if you don't eat enough protein, then suddenly that massive boost of extra amino acids, maybe that will help and maybe your hair suddenly starts growing and your skin looks better.
Dr Mandy:But why not get the diet right in the first place, rather than having a liquid diet of collagen, amino acids and bear in mind that collagen is an incomplete protein, so it's missing some amino acids, whereas, for example, an egg or chicken or soy are providing you with complete amino acid profiles. All of these are important, not just the collagen proteins. I do like certain amino acids that are very high in collagen. For example, glycine is a really lovely amino acid, which is collagen is very rich in glycine. So if you aren't ready to embark on a long-term collagen commitment because you can't afford it, which I completely understand, and I don't recommend it.
Dr Mandy:I personally take glycine, which is really important and it helps with sleep. Um, if you take two to three grams of glycine at bedtime, it's very cheap, it's, um, it's an amino acid that declines with the production, declines with age, so that is much more meaningful, I think. And also polyphenols, and foods or berries, anything red or vibrant colors, will encourage, um, which will help skin health, um, yeah. So collagen on the whole. To summarize it, um, if you believe in it, take it. Maybe you see minor benefits, but I would. I stopped spending my money on collagen at the moment. There might be a miracle product launched in the future with really hard, uh, evidence behind it and I might change my mind and and say, yeah, now you that that you can take, but so far I would say I, I'm not convinced. No, okay.
Polly:So, yeah, don't waste your money if you don't want to. Okay, it's really good to know, because it was so hard, isn't it? There's so much out there. We've been bombarded by so much. And the other thing I was going to move on to is really our skincare routine, because again, I liked in your book how you just made it so much more simple than again we're led to believe that we the the things that we need to be doing to our skin. So, in terms of how we should be looking after our skin, what would you recommend?
Dr Mandy:Yeah. So if you're young and you've got oily skin, you may want to use a more degreasing cleanser, but most of us do not have to use any cleanser or product to clean our face in the morning. So I personally just wash my face with water in the morning. I don't use a cleanser. I don't have dirty skin. My skin does not get dirty overnight, but I wear a night cream. So I want to wash that off and it emulsifies while I use that warm water with a flannel and I just wipe it off and it is. It leaves a nice little bit of moisture behind as I wash it off and then I put another moisturizer on, a lighter moisturizer in the morning because I don't want to look greasy, and then my tinted sunscreen. That's all I'm done in the morning. I don't wear makeup anymore because I have found a really great tinted sunscreen Factor 50, that I wear instead of foundation, and it's the bio company. I'm not affiliated with them, but they're called Medara and unfortunately it's a single tint, so you can't choose. If you have a darker skin tone, it may not suit you. I'm lucky enough that that particular brand suits my skin tone, but I'm sure there are loads and loads of brands that cater for all skin tones now and just buy a tinted sunscreen for the day. In the evening you want to get the grease and the dirt off that you accumulated in the day and then, if you've got dry skin, use an oil-based cleanser. I really like all base cleansers. Either they come in a cleansing balm type or you can use jojoba oil as a removal. I'm not a big fan for menopause women, of foamy, foam-based cleansers, because they're too. They strip your your skin barrier too much. So if you have a, if you have very oily skin, a foam-based cleanser might be suited for you, or a gel-based cleanser, but I personally prefer a cream-based or oil-based cleanser in the evening. So I wash my face. I wash that off with a flannel, warm flannel and, by the way, neither cold water nor too hot water. So you want to have tepid water that is basically skin temperature and that dissolves, lifts off all the grease and initially, if you use an oil-based cleanser, you don't need to apply water to your face because water and oil repel each other. So you want to just use the cleanser on its own, lift off the dirt and then use a wet flannel to remove the cleanser with the dirt. You do that until your flannel is clean. You clean your flannel, or whether you use a cotton bud or whatever you use to clean your face. Some people will call this double cleansing. But double cleansing then involves also applying a micellar water or going over the face with yet another thing. You don't need that. So if you sufficiently cleaned your face with your, with your, with your oil-based cleanser, you do not need to apply micellar water or makeup remover or something else. If your face is still has still residues of your makeup that you wore on the day, of course that needs to come off, but you can just use that same flannel. You don't need to use another product for this. Definitely not an alcohol-based toner. There's no need for that.
Dr Mandy:You want your skin to be clean, and then it depends on what your concerns are. If you start to see some wrinkles. I quite like a serum, so I do change my serum every so often. I sometimes use hyaluronic acid serums that are quite cheap. Sometimes I use a vitamin c serum or um. Peptides are a little bit difficult. Um, some people say there's not much evidence for peptides. Some people say, oh yeah, there might be some. But um, yes, it's a moist like niacinamide is lovely, so niacinamide with hyaluronic acid or zinc is a lovely serum, a lovely ingredient in most serums, and then you apply a richer moisturizer and once that's all gone in, you can apply a little bit of Vaseline around those areas of concern where you've got fine lines and wrinkles, particularly on the eye area, to mitigate the crows feet.
Dr Mandy:Vaseline is a single ingredient product and everyone's afraid of it, but it's a brilliant product that has never been shown to cause an allergic reaction. It's clean, it's pure and it's a really excellent moisturizer. It keeps the moisture in the skin and overnight. That's what you want. You yes, it's greasy and you want to just dab a thin layer on on the areas where you feel particularly dry, and all it does it seals the moisture in overnight. So you wake up in the morning with much plumper, healthier looking skin and it's. It's brilliant, you know, and one of the most expensive skincare brands. Um, that we know. The main ingredients is liquid, paraffin. Paraffin and liquid, which is nothing other than vaseline right, okay.
Polly:So washing face with warm water in the morning, and then yours on screen, and then, in the evening, getting rid of your makeup with an oil-based product again warm water, flannel, maybe using a serum. So hyaluronic acid Again, this is quite confusing for a lot of women. It's like hyaluronic acid, vitamin C, vitamin A, you know, all these products have all these things which they advertise, and it's like which ones do I go for? I don't know. Does it depend on your age or what sort of skin you've got?
Dr Mandy:yeah, so um it. So if it depends on the symptoms you have and your skin concerns that you have, if you have really good skin and no blemishes, no hyperpigmentation and it's just a bit dry and you want to, uh, protect it from environmental stress, a bit of vitamin c increases antioxidant levels, and antioxidant levels in the skin do decline with age and we have more free radicals that can cause skin damage over time. So vitamin c is not very stable. So a lot of vitamin c creams are not, don't have enough active ingredients, so it's usually a serum that you have to use that is pH neutral or in an oil-based carrier. Certain vitamin Cs are better than others and I do list them in my book as well, the ones that are working, but it's not essential. You don't have to have a vitamin C serum if you don't want that. But if you, for example, have hyperpigmentation or you start having fine lines and wrinkles, then hyaluronic acid does increase moisture levels.
Dr Mandy:Niacinamide can help if you have a bit of acne or breakouts. It's anti-inflammatory. It can help with mild hyperpigmentation. It will not resolve if you have severe hyperpigmentation, for example, but if you really want to target concerns of skin aging. So if you've got wrinkles, if you've got hyperpigmentation and if you really want to treat those, then you need to look at more stronger active ingredients like tretinoin, which is vitamin A, or retinoids that are sufficiently formulated, sufficiently strong for your skin. And retinoids are the most researched skincare ingredients that have been shown to increase collagen, to reduce fine lines and wrinkles and make skin thicker over time and more resilient. And I wouldn't dismiss over-the-counter retinol products because they can be effective and they can work. It just takes longer. But if you just have very fine lines and you're only in your 40s, you can absolutely use this over-the-counter retinol product. But then later on, as maybe your skin aging is a bit more advanced, you need products that are a little bit more powerful and have a higher concentration of a more effective molecule.
Dr Mandy:You know, and you may want to look at tretinoin, which you can get from a dermatologist, but you know what Aging is, so multifactorial. There are people out there with the most amazing genes and they will not get really deep lines and wrinkles, and then there are people who have lived in warmer countries with no sunscreen and they get the hyperpigmentation. You know, some women are also more prone to melasma or cloasma hormonal hyperpigmentation, particularly in the paramenopause. So it's it's very individual and and there's nothing wrong with having wrinkles. Um, at the end of the day, you you don't need to read you don't need to treat every single wrinkle.
Dr Mandy:Uh, we need to have our faces moving and and be able to have an expression of emotions in our face. But I do completely sympathize if you have a woman who says you know what? I always look angry. These lines here in between my eyebrows make me look perpetually angry, even if I'm in a good mood, and people comment and I can't, I don't like you know what. Just have a bit of Botox there. If that bothers, you try it and if it works, it works. I personally don't With those who do it really well. It can make a difference and it makes you feel better. It does prevent the progression to further wrinkling.
Polly:In terms of the Botox, you said something which I've not heard before. Actually that it's, and maybe because I don't really know much about botox, but it prevents you from wrinkling anymore. So actually it, it's good for your skin. It's good for your skin in that way is that you're not obviously using those muscles, so it doesn't doesn't weaken the muscles it does, but that's exactly what you want, so it does.
Dr Mandy:Yes, of course, you don't use the muscles as much if you don't frown so much, if you're someone who has a very animated face and you frown a lot, and then those dynamic wrinkles will become, um, permanent wrinkles. And if you feel, if you look in the mirror and and you don't like that, that look of you with a deep lines on your forehead because it makes you look a bit miserable or a little bit, you know, it doesn't reflect how you feel on the inside, then if you do it early enough, before these wrinkles are completely deep and static, okay, the botox will stop the movement of the forehead and will stop the progression from dynamic wrinkles to static wrinkles. And most people don't need to do it more than twice a year, you know, and and I'm not saying everyone needs to have those it depends on your face and it depends on on you feel about them. There are some beautiful women with with um, with static wrinkles that look amazing, you know. But then there are also some women who are really bothered by that and we shouldn't judge women at all and you know, if you do something you get judged, and if you don't do something, you get judged either. You can't win this.
Dr Mandy:I think it's about you and how, what you see in the mirror and how you feel inside. How does it, how does it affect you? You know, and are you confident enough to carry these, these beautiful wrinkles off? And if so, then of course you don't need both. But if you think, you know, I look always quite, quite sad or I look miserable because I've got this deep line and that doesn't, that isn't me, then you know what?
Dr Mandy:If you inject the Botox, it will relax the muscle. The muscle will start to be too thin a little, and that's exactly what you want, but that's not detrimental. You do not need thick muscles in your face because you that's the whole point of it. It's not like your glutes that you need to your big um. You know quadriceps muscles that you keep on working on because they are, they're usually beneficial for your longevity and your, your metabolism and god knows um and your bones, your face that's not doesn't apply to the face right. And yes, you can slow down the progression to static lines and um yeah, and I I'm with you 100 in that everybody is unique.
Polly:everybody has got to do what's right for them. And yes, we're all going to get older and we all have to accept that. We're all getting older and our bodies and our faces and everything changes. So we can fight against it and that's okay if that's what you want to do, or you can accept it and bring it on. But I think ultimately, what it's about is about just feeling as good as you possibly can within your own skin and whatever that is for you, it's, and you can't and, as you said, no judgment, it's just do what you want to do. But I think it's more about staying healthy, and you know, having is feeling healthy. When we feel healthy, then that's then we feel great.
Polly:So, yeah, I, I'm with you. I'm very conscious of time. There's so many things I want to ask you. Can I just ask you about, before we go about, hair, because another thing which I learned, which I didn't know from your book, is about washing our hair and that actually one wash is absolutely fine, and I was always led to believe that we needed to wash our hair twice with shampoo before conditioner. But that's not the case and so I will no longer be doing that and actually have probably been damaging my hair more by doing that.
Dr Mandy:So when you wash your hair, you don't wash your hair, you really want to clean your scalp. That's the thing you want to clean. Hair is actually not dirty. It's a dead tissue that hangs off our scalp and it is not really dirty, you know. Um, it's the scalp that we need to clean. And the scalp is literally the same, the same surface as our face or the back, and it we, we sweat. It has a lot of oil glands in some people not all, not everyone but it produces a lot of oil. So there's grease, there's there's dandruff, there's there's skin flakes, um, and yeah, it does get dirty. So we need to wash the scalp. You do not actually have to rub.
Dr Mandy:I get really horrified when I see hairdressers rubbing the strands of hairs together. I'm thinking, what are you doing? Because, remember, our hair strands are the most fragile when they're wet. So never, ever rub hair together, never use a towel to rub your hair vigorously, because the cuticles swell up and open up. You have to imagine a pine cone. And when the pine cones are closed, you know, the seats inside are nicely and protected, and they're nice, aligned with the shape of the pine cone. But when the pine cone dries out, the um, the, the little um, the little um scales open up and that's what happens when hair is wet. So you want to be extra super careful when you have. When your hair is wet, you don't want to rub it, you don't want to rigorously um kind of clean it and you do want to get all the grease and the dirt off your scalp.
Dr Mandy:If you have greasy hair, like I have, I have to wash my hair every day. If I don't wash my hair, I get very greasy hair and I couldn't get away. There's no benefit in delaying hair washing. If you have that sort of scalp, I need to wash my hair. If you have very dry scalp, um, then maybe you do not need to wash your hair every day. But then you also have to be careful that there might be a buildup of dandruff and oil over time which can lead to an overgrowth of yeast and particularly with seborrheic dermatitis, that can cause problems as well. And there are special shampoos for dandruff which usually contain a medical ingredient, nicorazole for example, um that that treats yeast, overgrown yeast.
Dr Mandy:But if you have greasy hair, wash your hair um, foam up the shampoo in your hands and apply it to your scalp and just massage it in your scalp, get clean your scalp and you do not have to specially clean your hair. What you do with your hair is, after you rinse the shampoo off, you put your conditioner sort of halfway down your hair strands not on the scalp, because you don't need conditioner on the scalp and just put the conditioner on that bit to help smooth the cuticles, to help. You can't repair damage, but you can gloss over the damage. You know, particularly if you have long hair, and not everyone needs conditioner either. It depends on how long your hair is, whether it's dry or brittle or porous or over bleached, over processed and, yes, so it is. Do not be afraid to wash your hair every day if that's your hair. But you do not need to use shampoo twice, you only need. There has been a clinical trial and looked at that and that there was no benefit in applying shampoo twice. Um so okay, that's.
Polly:I wished I had known that. And also about, you know, the towel drying, the condition. I mean, I use a huge amount of condition because I do have dry and kind of frizzy hair and so, yes, I need the conditioner so much, um, but I probably again put it on too high up rather than halfway down. So that's another really good tip, thank you. And then in terms of drying hair with a hair dryer, again you say that you're not too hot, but it is okay to to use a hair dryer again.
Dr Mandy:Yeah, completely. I mean there is, um, there has there has been lots of a kind of controversy over that Is natural drying your hair more damaging than blow drying. So there are people who really looked at that. So what is quite clear is that water, in general, having your hair wet, is damaging full stop. Having wet hair is not good. So that's when your hair is very vulnerable.
Dr Mandy:So when you brush your wet hair, do it really gently and just squeeze it. Squeeze the hair strands with a towel rather than rubbing them, particularly if you have long hair and it's quite dry and processed with bleach and so on. So in terms of, um, hair drying, um, so I think naturally, leaving your hair long wet for longer can be damaging. And there's some research that says, actually, if you do a blow dry, damp hair with a gentle, not too hot, not too cold temperature, and keep the hair dryer and they did this really quite meticulously 15 centimeters away from the hair. You don't want to hold that hair dry too close. 15 centimeters is apparently the the best for your hair and then, in up and down movement, um, then your hair will not be, or less likely be, damaged. I pass. So one other thing I would not recommend is to go to bed with wet. Wet hair, the friction. So if you go to bed with wet hair, it doesn't have a chance. You're lying on the wet hair and it could cause an overgrowth of certain bugs on your scalp because it's not got the chance to dry and also when you roll over you might damage your hair with the friction on the pillow. So I would always recommend to dry your hair before you go to bed and if you've got enough time to leave it to air dry, then do that and then put it up in a bun if you have long hair, or wear like a silk hair mask to prevent it from friction overnight. Or you can blow dry it before you go to bed, 15 centimeters apart, with a medium temperature, in an up and down movement and then until it's dry.
Dr Mandy:What you want to avoid is really hot heat. So straighteners which ceramic straighteners and really high heat. And I find some of the hairdressers I've had blow dries in the past, professional blow dries and my god, I'm always one of those people who sit there and never say anything, but actually I feel really uncomfortable because the heat is just horrific. You know, I'm like, oh, my God, I should say something, but then they are the professionals and I can just leave them do their job. But actually I'm really uncomfortable and I feel the hot. The heat is really bad. But I also find that you can apply a heat protective spray to your hair. If you blow dry your hair quickly and you want to use a higher styling tool, so get one of those silicon sprays so that, yes, and don't be afraid of silicons either. They're they just, they just um are volatile substances. They will disappear.
Polly:They just protect the hair shaft from damage while the hair is being blow dried is there anything, mandy, that you feel that we haven't discussed today, which you would really like to tell the listeners to mention before we finish?
Dr Mandy:we haven't talked a lot about hair thinning, but, oh gosh, we haven't talked about hair thinning at all.
Polly:That was another one, because that's another very I mean I I've experienced it a lot myself. It's my really noticed how my hair has thinned as I've gone through menopause. It's, yeah, it's a, it's a big issue for a lot of women yeah.
Dr Mandy:So, um, I would say just also look at the medication you take. There's we talked about hrt earlier there's certain types of uh hrt in particular the progestogens that you might take that are more associated with hair thinning um, and they are they're northisterone or levonorgestrel, so these are more androgenic um progestins that are in some form of hrt that you may find that may contribute to the health thinning. But then, on the other hand, we have to weigh up the, the safety of the. We have to counteract the, the downside solution on the womb. So you have to have appropriate progestins. Micronized progesterone, which is eutrogestan, is probably the the most hair and skin friendly progesterone. But not every woman gets on with that with it, but that's probably the least associated with with hair thinning. But if you do um have a c pro. So I would say one of the best tips is to look at your mom. If she has a tendency to have very thin hair down the middle or generally quite thin hair um at her age, then that's probably where you are heading towards. And if you are not happy with the idea that your hair over time will thin because of your genetic predisposition that you carry, then maybe do something before it becomes too bad. So you need to start maybe looking at minoxidil topically as a regain. You know, have a, have a go at this, see if that works. Maybe have to have some blood tests to check your iron levels and incorporate food rich in zinc and selenium and um, have a protein rich diet, because hair is nothing else other than protein. So do all of this and then I would say, if that is a concern, some women have no problem with thinner hair.
Dr Mandy:Other women are petrified at losing their hair, and the sooner you kind of do something about this, the more successful it might be to maintain what you've got or improve what you've got, rather than waiting until it's already quite, um, quite advanced. Because once hair follicles are no longer functioning and producing hair strands, you can't bring them back. But you can, you can do something while they're still producing a small strand of hair, you know. So don't be afraid to seek help and don't spend huge amounts of money on supplements for hair growth, and most of them are not evidence-based. Rosemary oil doesn't work. Don't take biotin for hair growth, doesn't work.
Dr Mandy:I would say, if you're really concerned, see a dermatologist and get a diagnosis, um, so you know what you're dealing with, and then go on prescription strength or over-the-counter treatment that is actually effective, and it's usually minoxidil or maybe a dutasteride, finasteride applied topically on prescription by your doctor, and that will then make a difference, hopefully, okay so just to be clear, once a hair follicle has effectively just died, you can't then grow a hair back, so it's just about maintaining what you already have on your head yes, so, um, as we get older, with lack of um, estrogen and in increased levels, so, or an imbalance of vision and testosterone, what happens in the hair follicle is miniaturization.
Dr Mandy:So you have a hair follicle which is like the bulb that grows the hair. It's like a flower, if you imagine, like a daffodil and um, and the hair strand that the follicle produces becomes thinner and thinner because the follicle shrinks as a result of lack of estrogen and but still too much testosterone. In relation to eastern. I'm not saying testosterone isn't good for it's actually good for her, but it's. The hair follicle is a hormone-producing gland in its own right and as we get older it may produce more dihydrodistosterone. It's the dihydrodistosterone that leads to a shrinking of the hair follicles. So the hair follicle produces a finer and finer hair strand. So over time you see hair is less dense. So you still have hair follicles, but the hair it produces becomes thinner and thinner, which makes the overall appearance of hair thinner. And while you still have follicles and while you still have hair growth, you can improve that, hopefully with the right medication minoxidil or caffeine products mixed with minoxidil and an anti-androgen medication that counteracts the the downsides of dihydrotestosterone once the hair follicle is gone, and that's a good example as a man, male baldness, a man who's bald has no hair follicles.
Dr Mandy:No, no amount of treatment will bring that back, because once the hair follicles gone, it has shrunk and then died. It's gone, and you and same with a certain type of scarring alopecia. Once you've got scarred over, once they have follicles no longer there, you, you cannot grow a hair. You, the only thing that will then help is a hair transplant. But you know so, um, that's why it's important not to leave it too late. If your hair is generally thinning, oh, all over or down the midline, and you you see your mum experiencing that to quite an extent and and you're worried about that, then I would say start sooner rather than leaving it too late, because once you see the scalp and your hair follicles may no longer be there and you mean you can then no longer not resurrect them.
Polly:Okay, so it's about going to see a dermatologist who will be able to advise well, you can start with over.
Dr Mandy:You can start with a bit of minoxidil already you you know if it's not so bad. So that is a proven, uh licensed treatment. But if you aren't sure about the type of your hair filling and if you aren't sure what's causing it and you want a definitive diagnosis, I would say a dermatologist is a is a good investment to see a dermatologist because they can tell you what it is, they can tell you, um, what treatments are likely to benefit you and they can prescribe you something prescription strength that is probably more effective than over-the-counter treatments, um, but if yeah, and they may also advise you if you need further blood tests to exclude other reasons, yeah, oh, it's so frustrating, isn't it?
Polly:we lose our hair on the head and then we get hairs on our chin in places we don't want are they the? Same. Yeah, when we find those, those random ones, I actually have, my children or my husband will suddenly go don't move and they'll, like, suddenly be plucking out her hair out of my chin, is it? But I mean, we're, we are going to pluck them out. Is that okay to do that? Is that the best thing to do? Just pull them out, don't pluck your eyebrows.
Dr Mandy:Never pluck your eyebrows because they will not wear back. You get traction, alopecia. So you know like women who have very tight ponytails or braids, so you get you over time that the traction, the pulling on the hair follicle damages the follicle At some point. The follicle could also die as a result of the ongoing traction and traction. Alopecia in the eyebrows is the same. So if you keep plucking your eyebrows, you damage the hair follicle each time you pluck that hair from that follicle and there comes a point when maybe that follicle will no longer produce a new hair. That may be desirable. But you know, the styles of eyebrows change over over time.
Dr Mandy:So whilst there was, it was very fashionable in 1920s to have very thin eyebrows. Now we want a little bit more hair growing and so, um, you, you. I prefer if women kind of use a very fine shaving tool to trim their eyebrows rather than plucking it. But when you want a permanent solution to your chin, you need to have laser treatment. Plucking an individual hair on your chin will not get rid of any more hairs. They will keep coming. Because what happens is you've got fine peach fuss hair on the chin. We all have it. That is invisible vellus hair, that we all have peach fuss, but what happens is, as a hormonal um imbalances which is the same and they have follicles we have more dihydrodistosterone um as we get older in our skin and then we have so-called androgen sensitive areas and the area below the the, the mouth around the chin and the lower neck is in a particularly androgen-sensitive area. So that means that the hair follicles are particularly sensitive. The scalp, the dihydrodyslosterone increases hair growth by maturing invisible vellus hair into a terminal hair, which is the visible hair.
Dr Mandy:So you may just have plucked out one hair yesterday and then you wake up and see another one and you think is that the same hair that I just plucked out? No, it's not. It's a new hair and because we've got millions of these little peach fuss hairs that could potentially become a terminal hair, it's a bit of a hopeless game. You can't win. If you've only got a few, keep on plucking them because you really don't want to grow a beard and that's really beneficial to keep plucking them if you can. If it's too many, then you may need laser treatment for this and the laser will destroy the hair follicle and you have to have several sessions because you need to have. You need to grow the hair out and then the laser destroys the hair follicles and then new hair comes out in other places, and that again you need another round and that will be a more permanent solution. But yes, you absolutely pluck away on your chin.
Dr Mandy:Yeah, don't pluck your eyebrows and don't pluck gray hair. I've seen women plucking out gray hair on their scalp. Don't do that. The more you pluck, the more you damage your follicle and and you won't have any hair left by the you know by the time you've gone fully gray. So do never, ever, pluck scalp hair.
Polly:You know okay okay, oh, my goodness, there's so much to talk about, but can I just say for anybody who wants more on this I mean there's more in in um man, dr mandy's book uh, what every woman needs to know about her skin and hair, about nails, about everything we've talked about today. So if you want to go in depth to really get a really good, clear understanding of the products that we've talked about and all of that, go and buy dr mandy's book. Thank you so much today for sharing all your amazing wisdom. You've obviously done so much research and work in and put that into this book, so thank you so much for writing it. I've really, really enjoyed it and learned so much. Thank you.
Dr Mandy:Thank you for your positive feedback. That's very much appreciated. Thank you so much for writing it. I've really really enjoyed it and learned so much, Thank you. Thank you for your positive feedback. That's very much appreciated. Thank you, Polly.
Polly:I hope you enjoyed this episode as much as I did, and I'm sure you've probably learned a lot about your skin and your hair. I will put the link to Dr Mandy's book in the show notes. I will also put all of her contact details in the show notes as well, so if you want to find out more by the book, go and have a look there. Thank you so much for listening. I appreciate it so much. If you've enjoyed this episode, please do share it with a friend. Please do like, subscribe, share this podcast. It really really does help so much. If you would like to come and connect with me over on instagram, come to at polyrun coaching, or if you'd like to sign up for free inner space breathwork session, the link is also in the show notes. That is all for this week. Have a fantastic week and I look forward to seeing you again soon. Take care, lots of love. Bye.